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Healthcare Wasn’t Enough: Congress Seeks To Effectively Control All Water In The US



Dec 10, 2009 64 Comments ›› Erik Wong

bluegold

The Washington Times:

A group of 28 Republican lawmakers from Western states is fighting efforts by Democrats in the House and Senate to quietly expand the scope of the Clean Water Act, the federal government’s main tool for regulating the quality of the nation’s waterways.

The lawmakers sent a letter Tuesday to House Speaker Nancy Pelosi of California and Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid of Nevada opposing efforts to rush through Congress the Clean Water Restoration Act, a bill that would allow the federal government to protect all waters of the U.S. from pollution, not just the “navigable” waters covered in current law.

The letter says that the lawmakers would vote against any legislation that contains the expansion.

The Senate Environment and Public Works Committee passed the legislation in June, and the House may consider a similar measure before the end of the year.

The House is scheduled to go on vacation at the end of next week, prompting Republican fears that the legislation could be tacked on to another bill on the schedule and passed in the session’s closing hours, said Melissa Subbotin, a spokeswoman for the Congressional Western Caucus, which wrote the letter.

Lobbyists said the measure could be attached to an unrelated bill with strong support, such as a spending bill for defense programs. House lawmakers are trying to pass the defense bill this year.

Ms. Subbotin said that Republicans’ opposition and the letter are a direct response to a story published Friday by The Washington Times on the “navigable” water issue. She added that GOP lawmakers were surprised by the House Democratic leadership’s ambitions to move the measure so quickly.

House Transportation and Infrastructure Committee Chairman James L. Oberstar, Minnesota Democrat, is writing the House’s version of the measure. He has not introduced it yet, but a spokeswoman for the committee told The Times, “Congressman Oberstar has told the committee to prepare to move a bill this year.”

Mr. Oberstar and supporters of the legislation say the provision is needed to clarify the scope of the Clean Water Act, the primary tool the Environmental Protection Agency uses to protect the nation’s waters. They say the interpretation of the act was thrown into question after two Supreme Court cases in recent years substantially limited the agency’s authority under the 1972 law.

Mary Kerr, a spokeswoman for the House transportation panel, said Mr. Oberstar was not seeking to expand federal regulatory powers. He instead wants to return the interpretation of the act to its historical definition, she said.

By deleting the word “navigable” in the act, the EPA, in conjunction with the Army Corps of Engineers, would have the authority to regulate all bodies of water, from creeks and small ponds to major rivers and lakes. Federal agencies currently regulate lakes large enough for ship traffic and their adjacent waterways.

But opponents, including a number of leading business groups, see the deletion of the word “navigable” as a stealth federal power grab that would harm business activity.

The American Farm Bureau Federation, the nation’s largest agriculture lobby, the National Mining Association and other business interest groups have formed the “Waters Advocacy Coalition” to lead the charge against the legislation.

The Republican lawmakers say they were spurred to act in part because of complaints they heard back in their states and districts.

“The concern we hear back home is that this legislation would grant virtually unlimited regulatory control over all wet areas within a state. This bill attempts to trump state’s rights and pre-empts state and local governments from making local land- and water-use decisions,” the letter says.

Specialists say the legislation would extend government regulation to 20 million acres of the nation’s so-called “isolated” wetlands and 59 percent of the nation’s streams that do not flow year-round.

“This legislation will hurt states and communities across America. The consequences and impacts of the Clean Water Restoration Act deserve a thorough and open debate in Congress,” the lawmakers wrote.


  • http://none WWTD

    Relentless government domination.

    • CPLViper

      Caught a clip of the Mike Church show today and heard they are thinking about taking control of buses and light rail too? WTF? Health, water, transportation, communications … velcome to the new vorld order, comrade?

  • http://none WWTD

    Relentless government domination…master and servent.

  • richwill

    Environmentalism has always been the horse the communists have been riding. The finish line has been total control of everything. We are living in a dictatorship by fiat. The only solution is to nuke Washington DC when congress is in session.

  • http://patdollard.com Average Joe

    ANY DEMOCRAT THAT LEAVES WASHINGTON SHOULD BE GRABBED FOR EXECUTION AS A TRAITOR!!!!!!!!

    • http://patdollard.com Average Joe

      To Obamabot DHS……fuck off you traitor Obamabots.

  • EL GONZO

    So, when is the civil conflict and when is the Secret Service going to be arrested in masse for aiding and supporting enemies of the US????? We can shout all we want but we should be doing something to disrupt this dictatorship……there are many, many ways.
    I guess the generals of our armed forces are simply standing by, maybe they too are pocketing from all of this, can’t figure out why is the constitution being trampled upon and they just sit around as those below them lose life and limb fighting wars they don’t intend to really, really win….

  • mike3481

    I got some water for them, it’s pale yellow.

  • Mark

    10 million in DC

    • CPLViper

      Count me in … itching to drive down to DC again … I don’t care if it is -17 degrees F in DC. If the call goes out, I am ready.

  • Professor Bill

    This type of action is being used in California right now to shut down almost a million acres of farmland on the western side of Central San Joaquin Valley. The farmland is watered from water that comes from the Sacramento/Stockton Delta and the EPA would rather try lie about saving a non native smelt than grow crops to feed people.

    These people are going to attempt to control our food supply, if you control the water you control the food.

    • http://none WWTD
    • mike3481

      And the evil doer behind it is Rep. George Miller, Democrat from the 7th district, which is the north end of S.F. Bay and just north-east of Pelosi’s district.

      This guy Miller has been screwing over California Farmers & Ranchers since his first year in office in 1975.

      Remember that the next time you’re at the grocery store and you’re freaked out at the price of produce.

      Yeah, he’s very much a radical Marxist. :gun: :evil:

  • politicalfish

    At the rate these assholes are going, 2010 is far too late. There will be nothing left to save.

  • TerryTate

    Damnit.

    Gentlemen, as a Civil Engineer I see this bullshit everyday in land development.

    You do not want this to pass.

    If it does, construction will come to a grinding halt, as any project involving water will have to go through mountains of red tape for approval.

    They need to kill this bill.

    Period.

    • NMPatriot

      Agreed, this is an unconstitutional bullshit power grab. I am in the same business. If these Marxist politicians really want to wreck the economy, this bill will enable them. This will virtually eliminate any new construction, and as Terry said, compound the mountains of red tape and bureaucracy. Our economy is driven in part by new construction, no growth no $$$. The states and individual rights would be abriged resulting in lawsuits against the US Government, who knows what carnage will result from this shit.

      In addition to all of this is the fact that we may loose the ability to enjoy watersports and fishing from boats, I posted this link on another site
      http://sports.espn.go.com/outdoors/bassmaster/conservation/news/story?page=b_con_FedsAccess_20091005

      This bill cannot be allowed to pass!!
      Another diversion from Health Care?

      NMP

  • http://none WWTD

    The water power grab has been going on for a while in the Northwest. Tree fornicators fight amongst each other on which endangered fish or bird to lead their noncause.

    http://www.klamathbasincrisis.org/esa/esa%20lawsuits/esalawsuitstoc.htm

  • Sully

    Taking out the word “navigable” does nothing to enhance Constitutional muster.
    But there is absolutely no way these usurpations will stop until the States and the People take back the power from the Feds.

    • dacoelec

      Let’s roll……… :gun: :gun: :gun: :gun: :gun: :gun:

  • Tom in CO

    Didn’t this same idea go down in flames in the latest James Bond movie?

  • SOC

    Revolt, revolt, revolt fight for your liberty now do not wait impeach and imprison, obama, pelosi, and reid
    fight for your grandchildren!!!!!!!!!!!

  • ODIN2012

    We have a choice…. Shout or shoot… I vote shoot!
    Let the Rebellion began. Shut the capital down!

    • dacoelec

      Damn straight…….. :gun: :gun: :gun: :gun: :gun:

    • Azul

      Your either arrogant or just plain stupid. Do you honestly think anyone is going to join you in you bloody escapade other than a few fellow crazies. Furthermore, what good would it do? History without learning is doomed to repeat itself. If you can explain to the world why your beliefs are the case than you can help the world, rather than senselessly killing individuals.

    • Sully

      We don’t have to prove shit to “the world”.

    • NMPatriot

      Thats a fact Sully!!

      And Azul, are you just going to sit on your ass and do nothing? We are neck deep in shit, what’s your solution?

      NMP

    • Azul

      My idea? Brace yourselves. Words. You convince people with words rather than trying to kill them. Oh and vindicating a cause is rather important. It causes others to join the cause and then you win when everyone’s on your side. Why do so many people believe in global warming? Scientists using science to gather support for their beliefs. Do the same thing.

    • Sully

      You really are full of shit Azul.
      Global warming isn’t “scientists using science”.
      It’s scientists colluding with politicians to steal money and power.
      Get a clue. Just don’t buy that clue from AlGore.

    • Azul

      And what could all these scientists have to gain by convincing the world of a problem that they knew the world would probably do nothing about?

      As far as the science of global warming is concerned I’m not even claiming these guys are right. I don’t think that they are. However they used genuine scientific data about our climate history to come to a conclusion. I’m saying that you should do the same thing. That thing of course being science. Use it to find holes in their logic. If global warming is a lie, then surely there must be holes.

      As far as me getting a clue other than from Al Gore is concerned (which I assume implies I’m a liberal) you are fucking retarded. I found this site through a buddy of mine who is a marine and heard about dollard. I then became interested in his ideas. I even had been signed up for active and had appeared in the chat room as Joshua (in hebrew letters). I later deleted my account after realizing how fucking retarded you all are. You people are the kind of dumb asses that make the right seem like inbred hicks. Rebellion? Shutting the capital down? This country is full of politically confused people who only need a history lesson on where liberalism lead, not a damn revolution and a new dumbass chapter in the history books. Fuck you and your preconception of who I am.

    • Sully

      Preconception? Maybe.
      You just proved it correct.

    • Azul

      And how is that? I also do love your avoidance of all else I discussed.

    • Sully

      Huh? I answered that BEFORE you asked. It’s not my fault you can’t/don’t read.
      It’s said that most ignorance is by choice… So I’ll just preconceive that you’re pro-choice as well.
      K?
      :wink:

    • Azul

      I really am not understanding you here. You answered what before I asked?

  • BTjoe112

    Water is Life! They say the next major war will be over water. The feds are trying to take control over water away from the states. So maybe a civil war is coming. And it will be over water.

  • Egfrow

    Oh Well, Who is John Galt?

  • killczar

    azul,fuck you and your world you sensless dolt. i hope your head is on a swivel, because when the lead is in the air, it will be comming from everywhere.

    • Azul

      My head on a swivel? Sir, your violence is unnerving. If you try to put anyone’s head on a swivel, be careful, I may be behind you. Me or my fellow Christians. Do you really want my life?

    • Azul

      I hope you come to realize the stupidity in you love of violence.

  • Sully

    OK… One shot.
    I told you ‘global warming’ was “scientists colluding with politicians to steal money and power”.

    • Sully

      That’s to Azul.
      FWIW

      the site keeps mis-placing replies for some reason.

    • Azul

      OK, I see where your going. I do applaud that an enjoyable discussion seems to be developing with you. Anyway the fact that I disagree with scientists conclusion doesn’t mean that I think that they are colluding with politicians to steal money and power. I believe that the scientific organizations who believe it it a “day after tomorrow” level of threat are simply wrong. Not purposefully, there is a lot of theory to support their conclusion. Mainly the fault I find is the lack of consideration of many “day after tomorrow” cultist (I like that name) in what the reactions of plants will be to a higher C02 concentration in the environment. So I did not prove your original claim true.

      Secondly when I discussed preconception I was speaking of your preconception of who I am, nothing to do with scientist conspiracy theory.

  • killczar

    azul- listen mother fucker they come onto my farm and mess with my lake and stream and i will blow them away. you don’t want violence then change your country, because to save this democracy we will have to fight for it.” the tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants.” Thomas Jefferson

  • killczar

    hey azulhole- you or the govt. fuck with my lake or stream and i will prove to you violence makes peace.

    • Azul

      You own both a lake and stream? The crystal meth business must be doing well. Seriously buddy what lake is it that you own? And no violence doesn’t make peace. Violence sometimes makes peace. Senseless violence that you and your buddies love is pointless. Relax a bit on the absolutes.

  • http://patdollard.com Average Joe

    :arrow: PAT
    I KNOW THAT WE HAVE SOME OF THE SMARTEST AND WISEST PEOPLE DOING THIS BLOG THAT ARE ALSO TECHNICALLY “ADVANCED”.

    PLEASE FIGURE OUT A WAY TO GET THE “REAL NAMES AND ADDRESSES” THROUGH THE IP ADRESS OF THE OBAMABOTS HERE AND ON SITES LIKE YAHOO BUZZ, AOL, HUFFPO, ETC. SO WE CAN FIND THEM EASY AND KILL THEM EASY WHEN THE SHIT STARTS!!!!!!!!!!!!

    :gun: :gun: :gun: :gun: :gun: :gun: :gun:

    • http://patdollard.com Average Joe

      PS-
      THAT SHOULD ALSO APPLY TO ALL THE LOCAL DEMS, ACADEMIA, AND ACORN FUCKS AROUND THE COUNTRY SO WE CAN END IT QUICKLY AND GET RID OF THE LEFT FOREVER!!!!!!!!!

    • Azul

      Good some of the wisest people that work on this blog show this guy where the caps lock is so that he can turn it off?

      I’m guessing that I’m the one your calling the Obamabot since I’m the only one that seems to be pissing people off. I’ll let you know that I voted for McCain. :mrgreen:

      As far as my real name and address the Ip address won’t work. I am a college student and mainly use their internet and for my apartment you would have to go to my isp to ask them to provide you with my address. Even the Fbi has to get their help. Without a warrant or some leet haxor skills your not getting my address.

      Oh and as far as the whole killing me thing that all the people on this site seem content to do. Do you really want to risk your life to try to end mine? If so you should probably go experience life a little more and realize that it kicks ass and not worth risking over an internet argument. Remember arguing on the internet is like running in the special olympics. Even if you win your still retarded.

      :gun: :gun: :gun: :gun: :gun: :gun: :gun: :gun: :gun: :gun: :gun: :gun: :gun: And why do you love the gun emoticon and caps so much?

      Oh and I’m not the left. I’m just not retarded.

      Love, Azul

    • http://patdollard.com Average Joe

      Azul,

      Hey, if you’re admitting you are an Obamabot, too bad you’ll be one of the first.

      Other than that, my comments are meant for many, who are the ignorant that accept Obama at all.

      Glad if you voted for McCain, but except for a few “brilliant moments”, he has proven he is the RINO-turd that he is.

      As for my IP-address finding comment, that is meant to find ALL THAT ARE A THREAT TO THE CONSITUTION and constantly say so here and on other sites.

    • Azul

      I apologize then, but surely you can see why it seemed that you were referring to me as the “Obamabot” since I seem to be the one pissing everyone off on this comments section. Now as far as finding and murdering people who support Obama, if you do that I’m going to come find you.

    • http://patdollard.com Average Joe

      Azul,

      When this new True Americans vs. Marxist-Left Civil War starts, by all means come to find me.

      If you’re one of the Marxist-types, I will not be the only one hunting the Left in this war.

      That said, I hope you have a long and wonderful life.

      But millions of Americans believe that the Marxist-Left that are against “Tea Party” America and the Constitution deserve being executed as a Traitors to the Country.

    • Azul

      Firstly, are the “millions” to emphasize a large number or is that a true assertion? If it is an assertion that there are literal millions, do you possess any polls to back it up?

      Secondly, your concept of me is wrong. I’m am not leftest. I do however love justice.

      “PLEASE FIGURE OUT A WAY TO GET THE “REAL NAMES AND ADDRESSES” THROUGH THE IP ADRESS OF THE OBAMABOTS HERE AND ON SITES LIKE YAHOO BUZZ, AOL, HUFFPO, ETC. SO WE CAN FIND THEM EASY AND KILL THEM EASY WHEN THE SHIT STARTS!!!!!!!!!!!!”

      You speak here of killing everyone on the internet who disagrees with you. People do not deserve to die based upon mere opinions and if you attempted to kill them, then I would attempt to stop you. There is a great difference between a conflict of armed combatants and what you speak of in this hypothetical war. What you propose is not just and for that I would kill you and the entire (hypothetical) right-wing rebellion if it was necessary to save innocent lives, even though I am myself right-wing. You would be nothing more than a new terrorist.

    • http://patdollard.com Average Joe

      azul,
      your quote: “You speak here of killing everyone on the internet who disagrees with you.”

      YOUR DAMN RIGHT….. LEFTIST TRAITORS TO AMERICA HAVE BEEN ALLOWED TO LIVE TOO LONG.

      Ya know azul, you’re boring the Hell out of me.

      Yes, we may meet in a future battlefield or urban-warfare setting on opposite sides. That is ok with me.

      Truly it is, since you are mentally incapable of comprehending any logic of good, not evil Obama rhetoric, or any real sense of right in the world of real America. So there is no reason to continue our banter.

  • killczar

    azul- sorry i don’t do drugs or booze. i am a carpenter, farmer that thinks you have been intimately acquainted with a rino.

    • Azul

      Your avoiding the issue I brought up that you are being to absolute in your views about violence. If your going to insult me at least through in an argument to make the insult be more intelligent, otherwise we might as well say fuck you back and forth.

  • Sully

    Well Azul we are highly unlikely to find agreement because the ‘theories’ are wrong and the ‘science’ has been politicized. No real scientist would ever say the “science is settled” and villify skeptics.

    To quote a real scientist who ‘solved’ the NASA bureaucratic cover-up of the first shuttle disaster…..
    “The first principle is don’t fool yourself”
    - Richard Feynman

    • Azul

      We may not agree on global warming but that isn’t the original issue, which is whether or not scientists would willingly falsify the data and whether or not you could use science to come to a better conclusion.

    • http://patdollard.com Average Joe

      Guess the thing Scully is that azul is beginning to sound like my ex-wife’s “scientist” son…..

      Brought up with a great family background, and now as a “scientist” he has has proclaimed his opinion that “Science is God, and no real God exists.”

      I also know that he would fake any data he needed to find the result he wanted. And he would be willing to kill to keep any lying, faking shit data usage from being discovered.

    • Sully

      :roll:
      yes on both counts
      now seriously…. how old are you?
      Because that’s an extremely naive question and also shows you don’t/can’t/won’t read what I wrote.

  • http://patdollard.com Average Joe

    Sully,

    sorry that I put the “c” in as scully on your name…. :oops: :oops:

  • killczar

    i believe i have the right to protect my land and family any way i want, regardless of poor govt. dec isions. call it absolute if you want. i call it my liberty. you sound as though you have a weak stomach, lad. maybe you should get out of school and taste the real world. fuck you.

    • Azul

      You said you wanted my head on a swivel for my opinion which has nothing to do with you or your farm. I merely said a violent revolution was bullshit. That has nothing to do with protecting your farm. So du mhan yhu my love.

  • Blade Runner

    Damn, I could have sworn this thread was about government controlling water. How the hell did it morph into posters wanting to kill politicians, fellow Americans, and each other?

    That’s one helluva leap.

    I’ll throw this in and see how much more shit will get stirred up.

    Azul said that the original issue is “whether or not scientists would willingly falsify the data.”

    Unfortunately, Yes, they have. A systems anaylst got ahold of the program code for the CRU Climate Change model. This is the program against which raw data is measured and tested for validity. The analyst has found that CRU programmers have embedded raw data in the model code that effectively corrupts the model’s results and, in turn, “authenticates” the argument that CC is actually occurring. In other words, the “scientists” did in fact falsify the data.

  • NMPatriot

    Fact; scientists have corrupted the data/models measuring the earths temperature, Fact; most of these scientists depend on grants from the government and private organizations for funding(Hence the corrupt data) Fact; carbon credits will be traded as a commodity and our utility bills will skyrocket. This is a scam and a way for a certain few to pillage the wallets of the American tax payer, Redistribuition Of Wealth!!! Not to mention the corruption that will accompany this bill.
    And…. does anyone really want to live in a cooler environment, do you environmentalists desire a cold climate, are you that arrogant to think that man can affect the global temperatures? Global weather and temperature has been cyclic through out the earths history and will continue to change.

    I stand by comment regarding the “Clean Water Act” another power grab by our shit-bag politicians!

    NMP

    • Blade Runner

      If this ObamaPeloser bill becomes law, all this other shit, the water, our food, the clothes on our backs, the cars we drive, even the air we breath, every fucking thing, EXCEPT THE CLIMATE, will be controlled. At least those arrogant reprobates think so. I got some news for them.